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KATELIN HOLLOWAY, HOST: You're listening to All Hands, a podcast brought to you by Lattice, where people strategy is business strategy. I'm your host Katelin Holloway.RUCHIKA TULSHYAN, GUEST:Many times, the approach that us as culture, people, DEI professionals sometimes have taken to create a more inclusive environment has ended up leaving out, excluding or maybe even causing harm to people who are most marginalized in the workplace.HOLLOWAY:I genuinely believe that we all want our colleagues to bring their very best self to work, but far too often women of color hit ceilings in their professional career, navigate microaggressions, and experience exclusion.TULSHYAN:I think when we really dive into it, when you solve for those who are most marginalized, you really come up with systems that benefit all.HOLLOWAY:That's why, this week on All Hands, we're talking with Ruchika Tulshyan. She is the best-selling author of the book, "Inclusion on Purpose: An Intersectional Approach to Creating a Culture of Belonging at Work." Additionally, she's the founder of Candour, an inclusion strategy practice, and has written some seriously epic inclusion pieces for top publications like Harvard Business Review and The Wall Street Journal... not to mention, she's a fan favorite and regular guest on one of my must-listen-to podcasts, Brené Brown's, "Dare to Lead," and as a matter-of-fact, that's exactly how I first came to learn about Ruchika's incredible work.Today, she and I are gonna talk about a few different things including how to take an intersectional approach to diversity, equity, inclusion, and belonging policies, and what policies are mission-critical to transforming the workplace experience? Ruchika, oh my goodness, I cannot tell you how grateful I am to have you on the show with us today, welcome to All Hands.TULSHYAN:Thank you for having me on All Hands.HOLLOWAY:Well, my friend, you have penned this phenomenal book, "Inclusion on Purpose," and I need to know more about the woman on the back cover, and how this all came to be?TULSHYAN:That's a great question Katelin. I'm really passionate about, "Inclusion on Purpose," because I've seen what it's like to be in environments that aren't inclusive, where I- I and others around me, people I love, people who I, you know, looked up to, people who I wanted to bring along on, you know, various journeys I've been on have felt like they didn't belong, and I have personally also witnessed what it's like, what a transformation it is when organizations, and when leaders really understand and operationalize creating a more inclusive environment. I think, what I've learnt in all the time that I've been doing the work that I've been doing, is that people don't want to be jerks, especially people listening to this podcast.Like, I know y'all care about other people. I know you believe in the, "Why," right, like I don't have to sit here and read through the business case for creating a more inclusive environment, you all already get it. I think the missing piece of the puzzle is the, "How?" The missing piece is those seemingly small interactions, seemingly small decisions, seemingly small, "I hired someone because I felt like, you know, they'd be a good friend to me," or, "I could go grab a beer with them," which has-HOLLOWAY:Yeah.TULSHYAN:... really, I know-HOLLOWAY:(laughs), right.TULSHYAN:... and you're, and you're, and you're laughing, and I mean you- you get this, right, I'm preaching to the choir here, but-HOLLOWAY:Yeah.TULSHYAN:... "the beer test,"-HOLLOWAY:The beer test sucks.TULSHYAN:.. the beer test, and-HOLLOWAY:(laughs).TULSHYAN:... and those small, "I have good intentions," decisions, that have really big impact, which aren't always good, which usually aren't inclusive. So, my idea, or my belief with it, with, "Inclusion on Purpose," was, "If we take a more intentional approach, if we actually say the hard things," we say things like, "We aren't being inclusive unless we are being intentionally inclusive," right, "If left to our own devices w- we're gonna make decisions riddled with bias," let's actually begin the conversation there-HOLLOWAY:Right.TULSHYAN:... and say, "With this, with that information, with that acknowledgement that we wanna go far, but we aren't there yet," what are those intentional actions and awareness, and practices that we can put in place to create the type of inclusive environment of belonging that I know we all aspire to have?HOLLOWAY:Can you tell us a little bit more... just about you, your incredible, phenomenal background, because this- this book is not the start of your- your journey through this world of discovery, and- and all of the things that you've done, can you share a little bit more about your background?TULSHYAN:I think, the thing that I often, and always actually... not even often, but I'm really owning is that, "I'm an im